[BrianWall-ChessList] One handed Damian Nash, Email #2, on I need a TD ruling

[Brian Wall]

I believe Harvey Lerman agrees with Damian Nash.

In the original Tyler Hughes-Philipp Ponomarev dispute Tyler, according to
Damian and Harvey, would not be able to reinsert a delay in the final 2 seconds
of the game. He could declare no losing chances and demand a draw unless Philipp
objected, then the game would continue with a delay with all three resuts
possible. The game was mutually agreed draw anyway at the wise suggestion of
Todd Bardwick.

In the Patrick Ledzian game, Patrick cannot demand the time delay be reinstated
now. Patrick can demand a draw. I am not sure Patrick officially demanded a
draw in either language.

Robert Ramirez could not demand a time delay in our game either even if he asked
for it right before his flag fell. He could not demand a draw either since he
was a pawn down in a normal position and we had not reached a Sudden Death time
control.


If the clock is way off, like half an hour missing, you can correct it at any
time during the game.
If the clock is slightly off, like no delay,
you have to notice it right away or you can't change it.

The only exception is Sudden Death, no time delay, less than two minutes on your
clock and your TD is not sure how to rule on your no losing chances claim. Then
he may install a delay after taking away half your time.

That is my understanding based on all the TD help emails.
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----- Forwarded message from chess at krusemer.com -----
    Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 17:09:30 -0700 (PDT)
    From: chess at krusemer.com
Reply-To: chess at krusemer.com
 Subject: Re: [BrianWall-ChessList] Damian Nash on I need a TD ruling
      To: Brian Wall <brianwallchess3 at taom.com>

Hi Brian.

I took an hour out of my day to type a long response with only one working
hand.  I was careful to look up the pertinent sections of the USCF rule book
and quote them directly, then asked you to circulate what I wrote to your
list.  You did so, but with a distorted and inaccurate preamble. 

You wrote, "Damian says a clock cannot be changed once the game starts."  I did
not say that at all.  Under some conditions they must be reset (such as if
players set it for G/90 in a G/60 tournament, for example).

You pitted me against Duwayne in a "he said vs. she said" way, as if to
entertain your readers with a TD squabble.  But in fact, I was quoting and
explaining the Official USCF Rules of Chess.  There is a correct answer to your
question and I carefully researched it for you and your readers, as you
requested.  Do me the honor, in turn, of passing it along as the official USCF
rules on the matter and not just as another TD's gut feeling.

Damian (in an unusually grouchy mood... see my facebook to learn why)

--- On Mon, 9/21/09, Brian Wall <brianwallchess3 at taom.com> wrote:

From: Brian Wall <brianwallchess3 at taom.com>
Subject: [BrianWall-ChessList] Damian Nash on I need a TD ruling
To: BrianwallChess at Yahoogroups.com, Chess_Improvement at Yahoogroups.com, "Brian
Wall Chesslist" <brianwall-chesslist at lists.taom.com>
Date: Monday, September 21, 2009, 2:33 PM

Apparently Patrick could have claimed a draw based on insufficient losing
chances because of sudden death rules. Then his opponent could accept the draw
or risk losing with a new delay.

Duwayne says a clock set wrong should be corrected when discovered, Damian says
a clock cannot be changed once the game starts.

Duwayne and Damian both say the clock can be changed after a sudden death time
control draw calim with less than 2 minutes of the clock.

BW
-------
Damian Nash

----- Forwarded message from chess at krusemer.com -----
  Date: Mon, 21 Sep 2009 13:13:59 -0700 (PDT)
 From: chess at krusemer.com
Reply-To: chess at krusemer.com
 Subject: Re: I need a TD ruling
 To: Brian Wall <brianwallchess3 at taom.com>

Hi Brian. 

A very similar situation occurred last weekend on one of the top boards at the
Santa Fe Open, which I directed.  The higher-rated player had a winning
endgame but only seconds left on his analog clock.   His opponent, who had
plenty of time left, turned down a draw offer, expecting to win the time
scramble.   I stood by watching, unable to interfere with the game, but
knowing that the player in the dire situation could make a legitimate claim, if
only he knew how to.   After the game (a draw by perpetual) I educated him
about what he could have done:

1) Stop the clocks and make a claim of a draw based on "insufficient losing
chances" (Section 14H of the USCF rule book).

2) The TD would not be able to adjudicate the game, because there were still too
many complexities in the position, ruling the outcome is "unclear."

3) The TD would then be required to follow the procedure to resolve the
situation, addressed in rule 14H2a (because digital clocks were readily
available at that point).

4) The game would continue with a digital clock (with delay) substituted for the
analog clock. 

5)  Important note:  Half the claimants time would be removed from his
clock.  So, instead of 10-seconds on an analog clock, he would now have
5-seconds on a digital clock, but with an extra 5-seconds per move because of
the delay feature.

6) His opponent would then have to decide either to accept the draw offered
through the claim or to risk losing a lost position.

The player in Santa Fe did not follow this procedure because of a complicating
factor,  one that he was already aware of.   There is a "TD Tip" following
section 14H2d that states:

"There is no rule allowing players, after the game has started, to ask for a
properly set delay clock to be placed on their game, which would replace an
analog clock or delay clock not set properly."  

Alas, this very experienced tournament player had remembered this much of the
rulebook, but not the sentences which immediately follow:   "... Only a TD can
initiate placing a clock with time delay capabilities on a game after a 14H
claim [draw by insufficient losing chances] has been made... As a result, the
player wishing to place a delay clock on the game must first make a 14H claim."

I hope this clarifies what your friend in Florida, and the TD, should have done
in his situation.  Please share this information with your list.  It helps
everyone if tournament players are clear about the rules!

Damian Nash
USCF Senior TD
Moab, Utah

PS -- as an aside, the player in question, who is a friend of mine and whom I
like very much, lost a game that he shouldn't have lost because the flag fell
on his analog clock.  Then came the game I used in this example, where he drew
a game which he should have won, again because of the analog clock. Â  I believe
he could have gone 3.5/4 and won the Santa Fe Open if only he didn't insist on
using his own, ancient, analog clock!!   But as we all know, time pressure
stimulates the adrenal glands, and for some the rush of adrenaline seems to be
unconsciously more important than the victory.  Chess players are mysterious
creatures!  Buy a digital clock, people!  :)

--- On Mon, 9/21/09, Brian Wall <brianwallchess3 at taom.com> wrote:

From: Brian Wall <brianwallchess3 at taom.com>
Subject: [BrianWall-ChessList] I need a TD ruling
To: Kledzian at mfi.net, BrianWallChess at Yahoogroups.com,
Chess_Improvement at Yahoogroups.com, "Brian Wall Chesslist"
<brianwall-chesslist at lists.taom.com>
Date: Monday, September 21, 2009, 12:09 PM



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I have some TDs on my mailing list so I would like an objective opinion.

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Kevin R. Ledzian is a Denver born 1500 that lost to Danielle Rice I believe in
the 2008 Florida Open.

His son had a winning position in the 2009 Florida Championship but noticed that
his own clock was set incorrectly with no delay or increment. He didn't notice
this until he was almost out of time, similar to the Tyler Hughes-Philipp
Ponomarev time dispute a few years ago.

This also happened to poor Robert Ramirez against me in the 2007 CO Closed.
I think he lost on time before he noticed there was not a delay like there was
supposed to be. Ironically he had to appeal to the person who had set my clock,
Dean Brown.

At this point Kevin's son was willing to settle for a draw but the TD said no
and restarted his clock after which he lost on time in a few moves in a winning
position.

Is there any official USCF policy about what happens when it is noticed -
during, after or right near the the end of a game that the delay or increment
has not been set up correctly. This is a fairly common situation and clear rules
should be passed. Also what about claiming no losing chances in a won position
with a few second left.

Brian Wall


except from Kevin Ledzian's email

 Kevin Ledzian <Kledzian at mfi.net>


This TD did not have a copy of the rule book, which I believe is a violation.

Patrick stated that he wanted to immediately appeal the floor TDs decision,
and
was told no, no, no¦not possible.  I believe denying an appeal is a
violation.
 The floor TD then unpaused the clock before Patrick was even seated.  Patrick
blitzed out a few moves in a won position before flagging.  He was distraught.
Patrick then sought out the chief TD (Blas Lugo) on his own, and was told
nothing could be done because the game was over.

 Kevin Ledzian <Kledzian at mfi.net>



Thanks,



Kevin R. Ledzian

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